Tuesday, October 14, 2008

Harrison Bergeron and Pedestrian Fishbowl-2

153 comments:

annes said...

What does HB and Pedestrian have in common?

Laurao said...

Is the city in THE PEDESTRIAN a utopia?

annes said...

Anne- I think there are many commonalities between the two such as...

mariep2012 said...

Anne - Both of them are persecuted for being different or challenging the system. HB is killed for wanting to not be equal anymore and the Pedestrian is taken away by the policeman for not doing what everyone else does.

jays2012 said...

If everyone in HB is equal, is the Handicapper General equal to everyone else?

alexandriab2012 said...

How could forget that your son was killed right in front of you? I know that she's not very smart, but still how could you forget!

robertc2012 said...

Laura- No, I don't think so. If it was a utopia everybody in the whole city would be happy. Mr. Mead is obviously not happy when he is taken away without his consent. A utopia is a perfect place. Maybe that's what the city was intended to be, but it isn't now.

bayleyk2012 said...

Laura- I don’t think that it’s a utopia… yet. Because he says, “Crime was ebbing;…” But not that crime was non-existent.

ashleys2012 said...

How did the handicap general gain her power? Isn’t that unfair that she has more power?

leslieh2012 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
bayleyk2012 said...

alex- I agree. Even the average person is smarter than that. Do you think that they have "dumbed down" society?

Laurao said...

Jay- I don't think that the Handicapper General would be equal, but who would notice? No one would notice because they are all to stupid or too handicapped to notice.

Brianc2012 said...

I was wondering how the Handicap General even came to power. Was it like an election or what?

PeterH2012 said...

Anne- Both HB and Pedestrian are about the limits of a totalitarian state. Harrison and Leonard both challenge the authority and rule of the dictator. Harrison is more violent and active when he rips off his hindrances, and decides to become emperor. Leonard just wants to walk the streets at night to get a breath of fresh air, and feel alive. Although he knows it’s illegal, he knows it isn’t hurting anyone.
What do you think of Leonard’s way of challenging the system? What about Harrison’s?

mariep2012 said...

At the very end of the story, it Leonard says that his house is the one that is brightly lit, and the policeman didn’t say a thing about it. Why does the author feel that he has to put this in the story and what does it mean?

BernardoT2012 said...

I think they are both about how the government is trying to control us.
For example, in Harrison Bergeron, the government makes sure everyone is equal in every way, they use handicaps. As soon as Harrison challenges the system, he gets shot. In the pedestrian, when someone is doing something outside the norm (like walking)he's arrested and taken to a psychiatric hospital.

nickb2012 said...

anne, i agree with marie how they have to challenge the system to be punished, and this also relates to macbeth and LOF.

jays2012 said...

Ashley- That is true. Along with my comment is she equal to everyone else if she has the power to make the rules and say what is equal? She had to gain her power through they system. She had to take it step by step and finally got to enough power where she took over.

alexandriab2012 said...

Ashely- that was one of my own questions too! Usually someone get's there power by force, or has a lot of friends and is the leader. Or by majority vote.

leslieh2012 said...

Jay- i think it is interesting when Hazel says that she would be a great HG. She wouldn't be better than anyone else. Like how the dancers were all as good as everyone else. If no one is better than anyone else, than no one is any good at anything.

loganc2012 said...

Laura- No the pedestrian is not a utopia simply because of the fact that a utopia is impossible. The pedestrian ia a dystopia. It is an attempt at a utopia but is not one.

hannahg2012 said...

Anne- I agree with Marie. Both Harrison Bergeron and Mr. Mead were punished for challenging the system. Both of them are upset with their current society and are eager for that society to change.

AustinW2012 said...

Bayleyk- I think they must have to have made the average person "dumber" because for everyone to be equal, if you're bringing everyone down then you can only have everyone as smart as your least intelligent person.

connorm said...

Laura- i think that the city is not a utopia but, it is very close. The city has apparently been urged of crime, which is something i want to know why is there only on police car? back to Laura since that the city is not a utopia it is not perfect but there is a definite (possibly culturally universal) pattern that the humans now follow and that is why the cop car collected him and spirited him off for research.

johnc2012 said...

Laura-
I think it depends more on what you think is a utopia- Obviously, Mead didn’t think that the society he lived in was a utopia, but then, for the people sitting in front of the TV’s and the cop back at headquarters might have thought that their world was perfect.

johnc2012 said...

Laura-
I think it depends more on what you think is a utopia- Obviously, Mead didn’t think that the society he lived in was a utopia, but then, for the people sitting in front of the TV’s and the cop back at headquarters might have thought that their world was perfect.

Brianc2012 said...

alex-I agree with you that it is wierd not to notice your son dying. I think that because it is such a dramatic event even someone who is dumb should notice someone dying.

robertc2012 said...

Jay- That's one of the ironic things in the story. The new amendments make everyone "equal", but the only person that isn't handicapped in any way is the Handicap General. These new amendments ironically put the HG in charge of everyone else, making it a sort of dictatorship.

katieh2012 said...

Laura- I think it depends on your point of view. Some may consider it a utopia because the families are together, no one is on the streets, police force is minimal, etc. Some may disagree though because television seems to be almost a “nutrient” to the people, who appear to have little contact with the outside world. I think it depends mainly on opinion.

PeterH2012 said...

Jay- That is a very good question. I don't believe that any of the people in power are handicapped. They have to be smart enough to come up with the new handicapps. They might be normal people, but they reduce everyone else to have power.

ashleys2012 said...

Erika in the inner circle- It was interesting that you brought up that both stories, HB and The Pedestrian have limits. If they are trying to create a perfect Utopia, isn't setting limits unfair and unequal? What is "equal"? Who is the one who sets these limits?

Laurao said...

Marie, I think that the author is trying to show that Mr. Mead is different than all of the others. This will soon lead to Montag and Clarrise in FARENHEIT 451.

connorm said...

Peter- when did we learn that i was illegal to walk the streets in the Pedestrian, the police car said he was taking him away for research.

alexandriab2012 said...

Is it just me or do both of these stories seem a lot like the movie V is for Vendetta.

jays2012 said...

Laura- Harrison Bergeron tried to take over in the end of the story. He failed and died. No one remembered them. I think people know that they are taken advantage of, but yes they are not smart enough to keep the same thought and use it.

mariep2012 said...

What would be considered "normal" in the story? What qualifies as normal in the story? How dumb and how smart do the people have to be in order to be normal??????

bayleyk2012 said...

Laura and Jay-I get where you’re coming from. It seems that the handicap general has more power. Do they really not see that. Also do you think that the handicap general has a handicap? Or is she really smart? Or of an average intelligence?
Leslieh- that’s a really interesting connection. I’ve read that series and I think it’s just how society chose to control it. In The ugly series they figured pretty was better is that true?

katieh2012 said...

Jay- I think this is where hypocrisy comes into the story. Everyone is supposed to be equal, but clearly this is not the case if someone is given a TITLE that allows them to rule over others.

hannahg2012 said...

In the inner circle it was mentioned that the government in Harrison Bergeron relates to communism. I think that is an interesting point to make. Do you think maybe that is the whole point of Harrison Bergeron? To criticize a communistic government?

leslieh2012 said...

It's really sad that Hazel didn't have to be mentally handicapped to forget her son dying. Are they trying to make everyone that stupid? Did they pick the stupidest person in society and make them the average?

stellab2012 said...

Anne- I would have to agree with Marie. In both HB and the Pedestrian the men challenging the system are either killed or put behind bars. I think this also has to do with the equality in both societies. In the Pedestrian, everyone was equal in their actions such as driving places during the day and watching TV at night with all the lights off in the house. In HB, if someone was not considered equal, they were carefully watched.

johnc2012 said...

Peter-

So because the rulers don't have handicaps, does that mean that they have total control? I mean, it seems to me they didn't really have control over Harrison, and he was only fourteen. What if there was someone like harrison who was older or more powerful?

connorm said...

In the Pedestrian is it outlandish to walk outside?
IS the one cop car there for only to prevent crime or because there is too much crime?

BernardoT2012 said...

Brian- Why should they notice? George can't think and every twenty seconds a gun goes off in his head. Especially since during the whole ordeal the noises get louder. The government controls the radio and are making sure that no one can think that maybe Harrison was doing something important.
Kill Revolution before it sets down roots.

I think that the governmnet wants to make sure that death means that Harrison never existed, and everyone eas equal and "happy".

jays2012 said...

Bayley- I think that the Handicapper General is smarter than everyone else. Maybe she was smart enough that she thought she could make everyone equal and make her a dictator. And it worked.

PeterH2012 said...

Connor- You're right. They don't say it's illegal. However, the police car kept asking questions to which Leonard responded to normally. When he was normal in our eyes, he was seen as crazy. The society changed normal to something leonard wouldn't accept.

mariep2012 said...

Stella, I was thinking the same thing about the communism idea! A lot of things written criticize the government like Animal Farm for example. I think that many people use their ability to write to show what they think and how one way of life would be good/bad.

Brianc2012 said...

Katie- I agree with you when your talking about hipocrisy. I think that to acomplish what she did, the Handicap General has to have some sort of upper hand in society more then the average people.

loganc2012 said...

Are we sure that in The Pedestrian that all of the citizens were inside? Is it possible that everyone else had already been apprehended in one way or another?

bayleyk2012 said...

Jay, yes but is she the one that started the whole "equal" system? Or did she just carry it on?

BernardoT2012 said...

John- Harrison was the anomaly. He was the one the government couldn't control.

What happened?

robertc2012 said...

Leslie- That's a good point. Instead of making the weak people stronger, they make the strong people weaker. Why?

jays2012 said...

Leslie- I think that everyone is stupid. The Handicapper General doesn't want them smart enough to take over. She has to keep herself in power and doesn't want people to take over her dictatorship.

AllisonM2012 said...

In the inner circle they were tallking about what family is. Does family necissarily have to be related to you by blood or legally adopted?

AustinW2012 said...

I think the problem with both stories is you can never have a perfect utopia because humans all think differently and you can't make everyone completely happy. In HB they try by limiting people until they are all physically and mentally equal but at this point it is torture to some with the handicaps but others need it for everything to be equal. The thing is we're all different and to create a utopia you'd need to make everyone the same in every way not even just using mechanical things but they need to be born the same. So the only way to have a perfect utopia is to only have one person because even with two people they will disagree on something.

mariep2012 said...

In the inner circle, they are talking about family. What do you guys think about family and what does family mean to you?

jays2012 said...

Bayley- She had to take over the power. We don't know if she started it or created the system. But what we do know is that she doesn't want it to fail so she makes everyone weaker and dumber than herself and her H-G men.

PeterH2012 said...

John- Harrison was the only free-thinker out there. He had learned how to overcome the handicapps at a young enough age. He can adapt to whatever they throw at him. Other older stronger people might have been handicapps after they had developed. They weren't prepared to deal with all this new stuff being thrown at them.

jays2012 said...

Can anyone tell me what the H-G men stand for?

bayleyk2012 said...

Logan- He says that everyone is inside,watching television. So has the society just been suppressed?

ashleys2012 said...

When people have more handicaps doesn’t that mean that they are better than the people without handicaps? Would the new “theme” be who has the most handicaps or who is the ugliest?

katieh2012 said...

Leslie- good connection! I have also read the series, and I think that the comparison shows that no society is created equally. By this I mean that there will always be somone stronger, weaker, smarter, dumber, etc. than you. This means that alterations must be made. The approaches are just different.

Also, in both cases, those who are DIFFERENT are seperated. The Uglies are on the other side of the river, Mr. Meade is taken to jail as was Harrison. Is this out of fear of "contamination"?

johnc2012 said...

Logan-

I think that everyone was either inside on the TV, at their job (like the policeman controling the car), or like you said, picked up and sent to the Psychiatric Center for Research on Regressive Tendencies

Brianc2012 said...

alison- that's a good point you made. i don't think that family has to be related to you by blood, but family could be people you care about or that you have been around for your whole life.

loganc2012 said...

Bayley- How is it possible to surpress an entire society? Who is controlling everything in the pedestrian?

AllisonM2012 said...

Bernardo- I agree with what you said that how both stories show how the government is trying to control people. It is much easier for the government to control the people when they are all equal. They know what to expect and can predict what the people will do and how to stop them.

hannahg2012 said...

Allison- I don't think family has to be related by blood or adopted. I have some really close friends and I consider them family. But then there comes the bigger question? What is family?

BernardoT2012 said...

Peter- so what do you define as "crazy"?

The police in the pedestrian seems to believe that different is crazy.
There is air in you're house, and there's stuff to see on the T.V. You don't need to walk, why is it any different.

The fact that the police (who represents the government I think)does not understand basic human feelings, what is the author saying?

connorm said...

Peter- ok but the police car was a program how could we be sure that it thought Leonard was crazy and that i was not thinking or computing that he was some sort of abomination because walking had become outlandish that needed to be researched and studied?

bayleyk2012 said...

Jay- but then everyone's not equal. Like what they're talking about in the inner circle. She's making them stupid. That doesn't make them happy. It also seems that your either average or really smart. Does that have to do with anything?

stellab2012 said...

Marie - If you think that people use their ability to write to express their points of view, what do you think Ray Bradburry was thinking about society and whether or not it would be good or bad and how when he was writing The Pedestrian?

leslieh2012 said...

Oops, i accidentally deleted a comment that people are responding to. For posterity, i made the connection to the Uglies Pretties Specials Extras series. In that series, to make everyone equal they make everyone pretty and fast. In HB they made everyone equal in slowness and ugliness. Why?

alexandriab2012 said...

I don't think that no matter how hard we try we can never be "equal," because no matter what there has to be someone who leads or there is aboslute chaos.
Caroline - I agree with the sibling comment,because I have a sister who is really smart and it feels like I have to live up to her standards and do what she did and get the grades she got instead of doing what I want to do and get the grades that I have earned. Also, with the fighting with silbings it seems like when I'm fighting with my sister it seems like after a while we have no idea what were fighting about,and then we stop and start laughing because we have no idea what were fighting about.

sammiet2012 said...

Marie- "Normal" in the story would have to be that the government adjusts to the lowest level of education. For example Hazel can only think on her own for approximately 20 seconds so there are people like George that have a mental handicap that goes off every twenty seconds so that he can only think at approximately the same rate. If there was a person who was born who could only think for only ten seconds? Would they make a handicap for that?

katieh2012 said...

Is there some kind of symbolism in the Pedestrian when the police car has no driver?

chelseac2012 said...

Marie – Well, I think in one way the stories are like a family. Everyone’s trying to be treated equal but there are going to be those simple flaws in the whole system which brings disorder to the structure they have.

AustinW2012 said...

peter- I think you're right in the fact that humans adapt to survive because he was most likely born with handicaps and so he grew stronger to be able to handle the handicaps to the point of they made him stronger then he would be if he never had them. It's like weight lifting, you move a bunch of weight around to make you stronger and since he was living with it on him constantly he grew quickly and had the best chance at challenging the system.

Brianc2012 said...

Katie- I think that the police car with no driver show that technology has taken over civilization.

connorm said...

Inner Circle- i am not sure i understand why a women scorned because she had a bad family would make her take out most of the human race or pore or less take them over completely? and if jealously is really going to force a woman to completely go dictator and everything?

bayleyk2012 said...

Logan- We can't know. The author doesn't make any refrence to the government. But in HB it shows you can be suppressed. But like Austin just said, "You can't be suppressed forever. Someone will break out." So in the pedistrian it might be more begind the scenes then in HB

hannahg2012 said...

Katie- I think there was no policeman in the police car because humans don't have the upper hand anymore. Technology has taken over. I think this relates a lot to the video we watched last week.

ashleys2012 said...

Bernardo- good point when you say that the police in The Pedestrian represent the government. The police is in The Pedestrian is only one small police force, only one small, broken down government. In the end the police didn't listen to Mr. Leonard Mead and didn't care to hear his opinion. Is this foreshadowing the future? Should we, the governemnt listen more and look at other's points of views?

johnc2012 said...

Ashley-

But, aren't the handicaps supposed to hide that fact? So although a person with more hadicapps must be stronger or better, they are designed to hid that fact. Also, with the "average" i.q and mental handicapps, I don't think that they can really think much about themselves, much luss how others compare

connorm said...

i think that the way a human body develops that the sacks would only strengthen their muscles and not weigh them down a lot so it is not a very good idea for making someone weigh more

leslieh2012 said...

This is a little off topic, but why can't we use a chat room? This live blog thing is really a pain in the butt.

jays2012 said...

Brian- I totally agree with you. It seems as nowadays, technology is taking over and we talked about how technology is a good or bad thing and it can go either way. But, as we read all the stories and watch all these movies in the future, it shows that technology is taking over. But is that really a good or a bad thing?

AllisonM2012 said...

Ashley- I agree with what you said. I think that there is no way to make everyone equal. Like what Jay said, is it really equal when the Handicapper General is oppressing everyone? There can always be the argument that someone is more handicapped or “ugly”.

chelseac2012 said...

Katie – The car with no driver shows the change in technology. There doesn’t have to be drivers because the car is like a computer, advancing. It reminds me of the show Knight Rider in which the car speaks and communicates with the people through earphones.

PeterH2012 said...

Bernardo- I define crazy as not different, but not having any desire of passion to change the world. People who just want to scrape by, and not try to challenge the system are crazy.

Smith on the inner circle- The machines are using us! The cop car saw leonard as an anomaly. It saw someone different as crazy. The machines don't want us to think differently. In HB there are the ear radios. They shoot out noise when anyone thinks of something too advanced.

mariep2012 said...

Stella, I think that Bradbury was trying to depict to us what the world could possibly be like in the future. When people see this stuff, they think, "I sure hope that that doesn't happen to us!!" Then people try to prevent that from happening.

BernardoT2012 said...

Katie- I think that since the police car had no driver, it's saying that the force that is controling us, has lost it's humanity. Which is scary because it's true when you look at society.

bayleyk2012 said...

leslieh- I think they just handled the situation diffrently. But you also have to remember in the uglies series. the operation also made them dumber. It just blocked out those thoughts. So in a way HB is similair they just went about it in a different way.

alexandriab2012 said...

I know that the government has given them limitations, but wouldn't you still rebel againist the injustcises? any kind fo governement wouldhav to be better than what they already have.

stellab2012 said...

Katie mentioned keeping people from "contaminating" society and Marie mentioned how writers express their feelings on certain societies being good or bad. Why might Ray Bradburry and Kurt Vonnegut think of society in the future this way? Do you think that they see equal societies being a good thing and we're just seeing it differently because of our times, or might they have seen it in a bad way, also?

Brianc2012 said...

jay-I think that in the case of THE PEDESRTIAN technology taking over isn't a good thing because tchnology made the people just go brain dead and they just sat in front of a T.V.

loganc2012 said...

Bernardo- What is humanity? How can humans lose their humanity?

jays2012 said...

Allison- I agree. Also, if you remember in the story, the prettier people had uglier masks. The smarter people had louder sounds. The stronger people had heavier bags. So does wearing an uglier mask make you look as good as a person with a mask that isn't as ugly. It still shows you that these people are better than others. If you have more weights on you, you are definately stronger. So it doesn't make you equal if you have more handicaps than others because not everyone can be equal.

PeterH2012 said...

Austin- Exactly!
Connor- It said that it was taking him in for psychiatric research on regresive tendencies. Think about this. What if the cop car learned from him. Maybe it was curious to see how he thought. Leonard may have planted a seed in the police car's mind...

ashleys2012 said...

John- good point when you said that they don't really think about themselves. What is this saying about their society? Right now, current day, this seems to be what is on most people's mind: What do others think of me? In this future, according to your point, don't think about themselves, what happend to their society?

hannahg2012 said...

Stella- I think that Bradbury and Vonnegut see equal societies in a bad way. I think that is what compeled them to right what they wrote.

sammiet2012 said...

Katie- The symbolism for that is that there is no control. That people can no longer reason why they do certain things. Also it shows that we could be addicted to technology. If you look at the part that has everyone in the house looking at the television and the pedestrian doesn't have technology, besides lights on in his house, and that is considered weird.

bayleyk2012 said...

Alex- In HB they prevent them from even thinking of rebeling. In the text George is thinking about how he can change the government. Then something goes off in his head and he can't even think about it anymore. Someone said that they were cutting of rebellion before it had time to put down roots.

alexandriab2012 said...

Stephine-
I think we could live without techonlogy,sure now a days it's are constant compainion, but I know that I could do without. I could live without my cell phone and my ipod; I think that as a society we should try to live without techolongy for a week or so just in case we ever had to live without so that it wasn't isn't as big of a shock if that ever happened.

AustinW2012 said...

The kind of ironic thing in HB is that by putting biggger and bigger handicaps on HB it made him adapt and become stronger and so in a sense they are helping him be able to fight the system by trying to keep him down. It's kind of like a social darwinistic theme of the strongest will rise to the top and you can't be on top forever. It's kind of like in Macbeth because he keeps doing things to try and keep his power but in the end it buys a little time but it hurts him more than it helps him because everything he's done has caused those under him to challenge him.

chelseac2012 said...

Alex – The government gives limits for a reason. There will be people who want to rebel but because of the consequences they won’t. Would you rebel if you were going to have to spend two years in jail and are fined two thousand dollars? Plus, the government has made the devices to stop the brainwaves for x-period of time.

jays2012 said...

Brian- That is true. Technology is bad. Although it helps us with studies and medicine, it makes us weaker. We cannot rely on ourselves for anything now. We add simple math problems in our calculator now. We are losing our simple behaviors. We have lost our basic skills and it will create a downfall.

leslieh2012 said...

Stephanie- hooked on technology? totally. At any given time I have my laptop, my phone, my ipod, and about 2 other devices with me. I am often see in "my dungeon" as my mother calls it. I have about 3 computers etc. It looks kind of like the batcave once you add all the cables and attatched paraphanelia. When I go to camp i leave all forms of technology at home. I even leave my facy dancy sonicare electronic toothbrush at home and opt for the good old manual. It's not like i can't live without technology, but it's hard to go partially away from it. We like to be all plugged in, or go cold turkey.

mariep2012 said...

The inner circle is talking about family and how technology is so important now. How do you think family is going to change in our lifetime due to technology???

BernardoT2012 said...

I have to throw out a general question.


Both stories show that when humans are all the same, things are peaceful. Everyone in a line, and there is no problem. Here's my question.

Do the imperfections and inequalities make society "happy"?

AllisonM2012 said...

Hannah- I agree with you about how we can actually define family. In the inner circle they are talking about how technology makes us redefine family. We have created a “regress” of human contact. Family is changing. We are not necessarily less as close to people it is just that relationships are different.

bayleyk2012 said...

Jay- I think that you made a good point. That even the things that were suppose to make them equal made them even more seperate.

Laurao said...

In the circle, we are talking about challenging the system as well as re-thinking most everything. What does everyone think?

chelseac2012 said...

Bernardo – I think the society is “happy” but because of the life they don’t know of. Not because the citizens have a choice but because they don’t want to go back to the hectic world they hear of from the government.

ashleys2012 said...

Inner circle- when Mrs. Smith said that it was scary when Leonard Mead got into the police car, with no police man in it. He gave into the voice of the robot. He was so scared of challenging the system and the punishment that may follow that he gave into a robot voice. He knew he would be taken to a place he didn't want to go but he still gave in instead of challenging the system even if the system is wrong.

hannahg2012 said...

Allison- I agree that family is changing. The relationships are changing just like you said. But is technology the only factor that is changing these relationships? What else is affecting it?

Laurao said...

Smith disagreed with me that we are not learning anything when I said that so many families are relying on the technology today. I think that we are not learning what we should if we would have as much human contact as we did in the 1950's.

hannahg2012 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
bayleyk2012 said...

Bernardo- I think that some of the "utopia's" make people happy. But think of our society. Most people would call themselves happy. Even with the bad things. Without the bad and you never know the good. You argue with someone and find a conclusion. You build relationships by disagreement.

Whoever made the chat room comment. I really think that is an amazing idea.

loganc2012 said...

Bernardo- Yes the inequalities and imperfections are what allow humans to be happy. How can the citizens in either of these stories be considered happy if they know nothing else? To be happy you have to know sadness.

AustinW2012 said...

I don't think technology is that bad because even though we rely on it it's not like it will all suddenly dissapear and leave us in the dark. It is a constant and will keep growing and it's not like if we rely on it to much it will stop and we'll die. People say that the technology might control us but I think that's just a hollywood myth because if humans create something it must be programmed and told what to do. You can't just turn it on and all of the sudden it's human and can think. Machines only know what you teach them and so they can never be ahead of you. If you look at some of the technology of weapons we have today it takes the person to use the weapon it can't attack you by itself.

robertc2012 said...

Inner Circle- Yes, I think that technology can be educational, but can take away. It sort of relates to right now- I would rather be participating in the inner circle discussion than having an artificial online blogging "discussion" like I am right now. Everyone in the middle is having an honest, real talk about the story and interacting with each other. We are discussing the story too, but we don't have the human aspect of it- we can't replace having a face-to-face conversation with someone.

jays2012 said...

Ashley- That is true. Why did it matter to the police officer if Leonard was married?

chelseac2012 said...

Hannah – Technology has a large role but I think the fact that the people don’t rebel or think for themselves is a big factor too.

Laurao said...

Hannah- that is a great comment! I think that outside sources such as friends and all of the other entertainment of today is another factor of regressing families.

AllisonM2012 said...

Bernardo- I believe that the imperfections of society are what make up happy. If everyone were equal then I don’t think that people would really be happy. This brings up the question, what is happiness or how do you define it?

BernardoT2012 said...

Chelsea- based on your answer, I don't think I got what I wanted across with my question ( idin't ask what I meant to).

So I'll try and explain. Let's think in terms of sports. If you are exactly as good as everyone else on your team in every way, is it fun? What makes it fun?

PeterH2012 said...

Smith- Leonard got in because he thought that there would be consequences even though society had completely dissapeared. In LOF, the hunter was throwing sand at the little one. He stopped even though there weren't any consequences

Brianc2012 said...

The inner circle is talking about if technology is a good or bad thing to depend on. I think that some technology, like medicine, is a good kind of technology, but some kinds of technology cna be bad.

johnc2012 said...

Bernardo- (and everybody else too)

I then have to ask you this question- do immperfections and other things similar to that, make society?

bayleyk2012 said...

Laura- I think that your right. We miss out on some major relationship building with cell phones. Like when I call my mom to tell her something we start talking about something else. That's building our relationship. She'll ask about my day. Tell me how are the sibilings are. It keep us hooked it. But if I text her I just get that one point down no other interactions.

AustinW2012 said...

ashley- I think that Leonard got into the car because the voice told him because in the beginning it threatened to shoot him. I don't think he would be ready to be shot just because he wanted to walk on a sidewalk. If I was at gunpoint I would have got in the car. If you were being held at gunpoint wouldn't you do a lot of things to avoid death?

Laurao said...

Jay and Ashley- The wife would have come to pick up Mead, but because he didn't have one, he had to get into the cop car.

ashleys2012 said...

Inner circle- when Kyle said we should try to change technology before it gets to bad, I thought that was an interesting point. What is to change about the technology? Maybe we should change the PEOPLE using the technology, we should change the teachers of the technology. Like Mrs. Smith said before, a gun doesn't shoot with out some one pulling the trigger, just like technology won't thrive without someone helping it along the way.

People always want to blame problems on anyone or anything but themselves. Is it really the technology's fault or is it our own?

alexandriab2012 said...

With the police car I think that Mr. Mead could have walked and he could have kept living the same way he has for a while, but I think that he finally just gave up and was feed up with the way his life was going and how irrelavant it all seemed.

jays2012 said...

Laura- Thanks for clearing that up. I was confused right there.

connorm said...

ok technology does not control anything, just like a math problem just like a paper, it produces something, yes it has a place in our lives but it can't control us completely. The only thing that would control us would be an artificial intelligence that is almost to the level of a human brain but can still think like a human and can have feelings like Sunny from I Robot. Sunny is the perfect example of a machine human and VIKI from I Robot is a prime example of a "brain" that feels it is necessary to control us even though we can survive on our own despite our flaws. Stephanie- it is true that technology can do many things that are somewhat controllable but are more subjugational and there is no way technology itself could compute controlling 7 billion people so we do not need to fear a artificial intelligence but more an actual intelligence that could use force to control us.

leslieh2012 said...

We just got a Wii. Upon exploring the system, I found it shocking that you can hook it up to the internet to get news and weather. In every sci fi media that ever existed there is some technology that is "the house". It tells you everything you need to know and is the ultimate technology. Think of the Jetsons, and Back to the Future. I think nintendo made a step towards becoming that device. It is just concentrating everything that you need technology-wise into one monster computer. That kindof makes us more dependant on that machene. If our ipod fails we are still able to work the oven. Not to bash the Wii, but that really got me thinking.

Laurao said...

Brian- I totally agree, sometimes technology can be good, but look at the video that Smtih showed us at the begining of the school year. Technology could over run us in the near future.

bayleyk2012 said...

Austin, Ashley, and everyone talking about the police car. Would you get in the car r keep walking? What would be the results of that?

ashleys2012 said...

Austin- I agree with your point when you said that Leonard wound't have gotten in to police car if he wouldn't have been threatened by the gun point. But my question is, why did the gun even come into play? It was not necessary. Leonard was just walking on the sidewalk. Does that action deserve a gun point?

BernardoT2012 said...

In the society in either of these stories (and in F451, if anyone's started reading yet) are the people really happy?


Are they really acting human?

chelseac2012 said...

Technology isn’t bad, it’s the way people use the technology. It’s the way people develop it.

jays2012 said...

Connor- Doesn't VIKI take over though? So in that, the technology is controlling all the robots. The computer challenges the people. The computer got so strong that it made all the robots bad and if you remember they tried to kill the people.

AllisonM2012 said...

In the inner circle they talked about how the people in HB think they live in a perfect society. In my history class and when we di the texting polls, we talked about censoring information and if that is ever appropriate. If censoring information makes people happy, then is it appropriate?

connorm said...

Ashley- I agree with you because technology needs a operator and there is one way to stop advancing technology Kyle and it would be called going back to the middle ages and that is a much worse time than we have now. Technology has made a lot of very good advances in the medical field and many more.

katieh2012 said...

So I'm not sure if this has been brought up yet, but what are the authors saying about what will become of our society? Its really broad, I know, but just let me know what you think.

bayleyk2012 said...

Chelsea!- thank you. It's how society uses that tech. that makes it "good" or "evil" Where is our society going with technology.

Laurao said...

Bayley- I would get into the cop car. The inner circle is talking about his family. Mead doesn't have a family, so he got into the car.

alexandriab2012 said...

I agree with connor because it's the humans that have to create the technology. I, Robot is a fabulous example because that movie really proves that techology can have good nd bad effects.

robertc2012 said...

Technology gives and takes so much. Mrs. Smith is saying that this conversation is going to be preserved for a long time. This talk will be forever here. Isn't that kind of sad? Instead of having a real, true discussion, we are "talking" to each other online. Do we want to remember this forever? Wouldn't you rather have a special time in your memory that can never be repeated instead of being able to watch it on your video camera over and over? Which is going to make better memories: talking or blogging?

jonathanp2012 said...

soAnnes:

jonathanp2012 said...

Jacob: I do agree with jacab and kailyn that the poeple have no liberty and it is illegal to challenge the system.

jonathanp2012 said...

I agree with bridget saying that no can be equal, the handicapper general is the highest in rank.